Podcasts Archive - Page 4 of 77 - Retirement Wisdom

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Most of us know about lifespan and healthspan—but have you thought about your joyspan?  Gerontologist Dr. Kerry Burnight is the author of  Joyspan: The Art and Science of Thriving in Life’s Second Half. She shares her research and practical wisdom on how to extend not just the years of our lives, but the years we will truly enjoy living. Drawing from her “Joyspan Matrix” and decades of experience, Kerry, a nationally recognized advocate for positive aging, offers a fresh perspective and new thinking on thriving in later life for your consideration.

We discuss:

  • The importance of joyspan alongside lifespan and healthspan
  • What she’s learned from her longest running case study (her Mom)
  • Lessons from her grandmothers’ contrasting approaches to aging
  • The four pillars of the Joyspan Matrix: Grow, Connect, Adapt, and Give
  • Why connection is as vital as medicine
  • How purpose can change our biology and well-being
  • Practical ways to spark curiosity and joy through personal projects

Kerry Burnight joins us from Southern California.

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Bio

Dr. Kerry Burnight, America’s Gerontologist, is sparking a revolution to make older better.

Fed up with the fear-driven, anti-aging hysteria, hundreds of thousands of people turn to “Dr. Kerry” for her practical, effective and uplifting approach to navigating longevity. Her approach to aging is based upon a profound truth: the key to good longevity isn’t the length of your life, it’s the quality of your life. Efforts to maximize lifespan and even healthspan don’t address the whole picture. Longevity is meaningless if you don’t like your life. Burnight introduces the critical concept, “joyspan,” based on the science of well-being, contentment, connection, meaning, growth, choice, and purpose.

She earned her PhD in Gerontology at the University of Southern California. Dr. Burnight taught Geriatric Medicine and Gerontology for 18 years at the University of California, Irvine School of Medicine. She was an invited speaker to the U.S. White House at the Elder Justice Summit and at the U.S. Department of Justice. She has appeared on CBS News, NBC News, The Doctors, Money Matters, and The Dr. Phil Show.

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Joyspan: The Art and Science of Thriving in Life’s Second Half

Website

On CBS Mornings with Gayle King and team (4 minutes)

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Podcast Conversations You May Like

Thinking Better to Live Better – Dr. Woo-kyoung Ahn

Ageism Unmasked – Dr. Tracey Gendron

The Joy Choice – Dr. Michelle Segar

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About The Retirement Wisdom Podcast

There are many podcasts on retirement, often hosted by financial advisors with their own financial motives, that cover the money side of the street. This podcast is different. You’ll get smarter about the investment decisions you’ll make about the most important asset you’ll have in retirement: your time.

About Retirement Wisdom

I help people who are retiring, but aren’t quite done yet, discover what’s next and build their custom version of their next life. A meaningful retirement doesn’t just happen by accident.

Schedule a call today to discuss how the Designing Your Life process created by Bill Burnett & Dave Evans can help you make your life in retirement a great one — on your own terms.

About Your Podcast Host

Joe Casey is an executive coach who helps people design their next life after their primary career and create their version of The Multipurpose Retirement.™ He created his own next chapter after a 26-year career at Merrill Lynch, where he was Senior Vice President and Head of HR for Global Markets & Investment Banking.

Joe has earned Master’s degrees from the University of Southern California in Gerontology (at age 60), the University of Pennsylvania, and Middlesex University (UK), a BA in Psychology from the University of Massachusetts at Amherst, and his coaching certification from Columbia University.

In addition to his work with clients, Joe hosts The Retirement Wisdom Podcast, ranked in the top 1% globally in popularity by Listen Notes, with over 1.6 million downloads. Business Insider recognized Joe as one of 23 innovative coaches who are making a difference. He’s the author of Win the Retirement Game: How to Outsmart the 9 Forces Trying to Steal Your Joy.

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Wise Quotes

On the Joy Span Concept

       “So the three-legged stool: lifespan, how long you live; health span, how long you live a healthy life; and joy           span, how long you enjoy living. And I think between those three pillars, we really can dig into some really           interesting longevity topics.”

On Expectations Shaping Reality

It wasn’t because one was just lucky, and it also wasn’t just because of genetics. It was these internal characteristics and a decision on the part of both of them, that what they expected old age to be like was in fact that way.”

On Genetics and Lifestyle Choices

Some studies show that it is 25%. Others show it as low as 13%. So regardless, what that shows us is that at least 75% isn’t genetic, and that’s where the effort, knowledge, and decision every single day really comes into play.”

On Taking Initiative

We’ve got to be proactive and you have to kiss a lot of frogs, right, so it takes a few putting yourself out there until you find someone, but the good news is the world is a lonely place and by reaching out and connecting you’re solving the problem of two people.”

On Purpose and Giving

It could be as simple as, hey I’ve got some extra lemons in my yard, I’m gonna go next door, hand them to my neighbor, maybe strike up a conversation… And that giving is life-changing not only for that next-door neighbor, but equally if not more so for you.”

On Embracing Your Age

There is so much value in the experience of being older… I’ve been 30, but I’ve also been 40, 50, 60, 70, whatever. And I’m going to reach out. And when you don’t make a big deal about it or when you show up embracing your age, the younger people love it as well.”

September 7th is Grandparents’ Day!

Celebrate the grandparents in your life or reflect on your own grandparenting journey.


This is a special Retirement Roundtable episode, where we invite previous guests to engage in a conversation with each other. Returning are Ted Page, author of the new book Good Grandpa: Stories from the Heart of Grandfatherhood, and Kerry Byrne, founder of The Long Distance Grandparent. They’re bringing different perspectives on, and experiences with, one of retirement’s most complex yet rewarding roles: modern grandparenting. This isn’t the hands-off grandparenting of yesteryear. Today’s grandparents face unique challenges. They must actively build connections, learn, leverage, and adapt to emerging technologies; and navigate changing family roles and dynamics, walking the delicate line between sharing wisdom and overstepping boundaries.

We Discuss:

  • How grandparenting has evolved
  • Why modern grandparenting requires more intentionality
  • How humor and fun create trust and lasting bonds
  • How to navigate different parenting philosophies with adult childrenLeveraging technology while staying mindful of balance
  • The powerful impact of sharing family stories and traditions
  • Ways to create meaningful experiences across generations

Kerry Byrne joins us from Toronto, and Ted Page joins us from Vermont.

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For More on Ted Page

Good Grandpa: Stories from the Heart of Grandfatherhood

Blog: GoodGrandpa.com – Nurturing the Next Generation

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For More on Kerry Byrne

The Long Distance Grandparent

FREE Printable Cheat Sheet to Help you Connect with your Grandchild from a Distance

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Podcast Conversations You May Like

The Long Distance Grandparent – Kerry Byrne PhD

Good Grandpa – Ted Page

The Mindful Grandparent – Dr. Shirley Showalter

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Mentioned in This Podcast Conversation

Dr. Becky

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About The Retirement Wisdom Podcast

There are many podcasts on retirement, often hosted by financial advisors with their own financial motives, that cover the money side of the street. This podcast is different. You’ll get smarter about the investment decisions you’ll make about the most important asset you’ll have in retirement: your time.

About Retirement Wisdom

I help people who are retiring, but aren’t quite done yet, discover what’s next and build their custom version of their next life. A meaningful retirement doesn’t just happen by accident.

Schedule a call today to discuss how the Designing Your Life process created by Bill Burnett & Dave Evans can help you make your life in retirement a great one — on your own terms.

About Your Podcast Host

Joe Casey is an executive coach who helps people design their next life after their primary career and create their version of The Multipurpose Retirement.™ He created his own next chapter after a 26-year career at Merrill Lynch, where he was Senior Vice President and Head of HR for Global Markets & Investment Banking.

Joe has earned Master’s degrees from the University of Southern California in Gerontology (at age 60), the University of Pennsylvania, and Middlesex University (UK), a BA in Psychology from the University of Massachusetts at Amherst, and his coaching certification from Columbia University.

In addition to his work with clients, Joe hosts The Retirement Wisdom Podcast, ranked in the top 1% globally in popularity by Listen Notes, with over 1.6 million downloads. Business Insider recognized Joe as one of 23 innovative coaches who are making a difference. He’s the author of Win the Retirement Game: How to Outsmart the 9 Forces Trying to Steal Your Joy.

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Wise Quotes

On Grandparenting

” Be there for them.”

Ted Page

On Connection

“Having a relationship with a grandparent is not a nice to have. We know from the research, that, you know, having this relationship affects children in a number of different ways from adolescents well into adulthood. And so I think that this is the difference, this intentionality, and this awareness of the importance of the relationship.”

Kerry Byrne

On Humor

“At one point my grandchild asked, where are Mom and Dad? And I said, Mom and Dad have left to join the circus, but before they left they asked me to tell you that they loved you very much, but what they really want to do is train bears. And I remember my grandkid looking at me with this look of first, he was a bit stunned, but then he kind of shook his head and said, ‘Oh, okay.’ And for me, that was just my sense of humor, but he picked up on it right away. He was two. So I think that sense of fun, having that sense of humor, you got to be who you are. And that starts when they’re just so little. And before you know it, they’re the ones who are, telling jokes and playing around with us.”

– Ted Page

On Encouragement

“So if you come to it with a place of curiosity, and also remembering that the most important role that you can play is as I call it the GEO, the Grand Encouragement Officer. That means like you’re the family cheerleader. And by that it’s a Grand Encouragement Officer requires encouraging and cheering the parents on. as well because they are parenting in a bit of a different context right now.”

Kerry Byrne

 

 

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How much time do you spend working out your body versus working out your emotional health? Physical fitness requires daily practice—hitting the gym once won’t deliver the results you want. But when it comes to our emotions, we often think we’ll “deal with that later” or assume we don’t need to actively work on our emotional well-being.

Emily Anhalt, clinical psychologist and author of Flex Your Feelings: Train Your Brain to Develop the 7 Traits of Emotional Fitness, knows this approach doesn’t work. She’s developed a framework for “emotional fitness”—an ongoing, proactive practice of strengthening your mental and emotional health through small, consistent habits that build resilience, curiosity, and communication skills before you need them.

In this conversation, Emily shares how emotionally fit people approach life differently, why playfulness is a valuable health practice (with research to back it up), and practical strategies you can implement today. Her insights are particularly valuable and timely for those navigating retirement transitions, when stress doesn’t disappear—it simply changes form.

Emily Anhalt joins us from California.

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We Discuss

  • Why emotional fitness requires daily practice, just like physical fitness
  • How curiosity transforms defensiveness into opportunities for growth
  • Why playfulness can increase creativity, collaboration, and longevity
  • The hidden stress of retirement: identity, relationships, and meaning
  • Setting boundaries: every “yes” is also a “no” to something else
  • The power of “Relationship Retros” for proactive connection
  • Using emojis strategically to improve communication and reduce misunderstandings
  • Building new friendships through your existing network
  • The monthly feedback message that can transform your relationships

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Bio

Dr. Emily Anhalt is the author of  Flex Your Feelings: Train Your Brain to Develop the 7 Traits of Emotional Fitness. She is a clinical psychologist, author, and cofounder of Coa, the gym for mental health.

For the past fifteen years, Dr. Anhalt has worked clinically with executives, founders, and tech employees, and has conducted extensive research with prominent psychologists and entrepreneurs about how leaders can improve their emotional health.

Dr. Anhalt has collaborated with companies like Google, Salesforce, NBCUniversal, NASDAQ, and the NBA.

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For More on Dr. Emily Anhalt

Flex Your Feelings: Train Your Brain to Develop the 7 Traits of Emotional Fitness

Website

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Podcast Conversations You May Like

Ditch Your Baggage – Dr. Bob Rosen

Retire Happy – Dr. Catherine Sanderson

The Emotionally Intelligent Retirement – Kate Schroeder & Nick Wignall

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About The Retirement Wisdom Podcast

There are many podcasts on retirement, often hosted by financial advisors with their own financial motives, that cover the money side of the street. This podcast is different. You’ll get smarter about the investment decisions you’ll make about the most important asset you’ll have in retirement: your time.

About Retirement Wisdom

I help people who are retiring, but aren’t quite done yet, discover what’s next and build their custom version of their next life. A meaningful retirement doesn’t just happen by accident.

Schedule a call today to discuss how the Designing Your Life process created by Bill Burnett & Dave Evans can help you make your life in retirement a great one — on your own terms.

About Your Podcast Host

Joe Casey is an executive coach who helps people design their next life after their primary career and create their version of The Multipurpose Retirement.™ He created his own next chapter after a 26-year career at Merrill Lynch, where he was Senior Vice President and Head of HR for Global Markets & Investment Banking.

Joe has earned Master’s degrees from the University of Southern California in Gerontology (at age 60), the University of Pennsylvania, and Middlesex University (UK), a BA in Psychology from the University of Massachusetts at Amherst, and his coaching certification from Columbia University.

In addition to his work with clients, Joe hosts The Retirement Wisdom Podcast, ranked in the top 1% globally in popularity by Listen Notes, with over 1.6 million downloads. Business Insider recognized Joe as one of 23 innovative coaches who are making a difference. He’s the author of Win the Retirement Game: How to Outsmart the 9 Forces Trying to Steal Your Joy.

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Wise Quotes

On Emotional Fitness
“Emotional fitness is an ongoing proactive practice of strengthening your mental and emotional health. It’s all about small, consistent reps that strengthen skills like resilience, curiosity, communication, before you need them so that you are emotionally strong and can handle whatever life throws at you.”

On Growth vs. Avoidance
“Emotionally fit people don’t avoid uncomfortable emotions and situations. Instead of saying, ‘Oh, I shouldn’t feel sad about this,‘ they might ask themselves, ‘what is my sadness trying to tell me? What is it pointing to?'”

On Playfulness as Medicine
“There was one study I read that showed that playfulness increases creativity, collaboration, and connection all around. And there was another study I read that showed that people who play regularly live longer by a significant number of years than people who don’t play regularly. That’s how important it is to our well-being.”

On Boundaries and Empathy
“A lot of people think that empathy and boundaries are mutually exclusive but they’re actually very important to each other. The stronger your boundaries, the more connected and empathetic you’ll be able to be with people because you won’t get resentful or frustrated over time.”

On Retirement Transitions
“Stress doesn’t just vanish in retirement. It kind of changes shape. Instead of deadlines or performance reviews, the stress might be about identity—who am I now without my job? The stress might be about relationships—how do I spend more time with my partner without driving each other crazy? Or the stress might be about meaning—what is my purpose?”

On Curiosity 
“Curiosity can mean a lot of things, but when I talk about emotional fitness, I define it as moving us from a place of defensiveness to a place of understanding. When someone comes to you with difficult feedback, a curious person is going to ask questions, they’re going to stay committed to growth.”

How much have you invested for the financial side of your retirement?

How about the non-financial side?

Join us for six Fridays starting on October 3rd and get moving on your roadmap.

Learn more here.

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Transitions are rarely easy, whether you’re leaving your career or any other life chapter that has helped define you. Cassidy Krug knows this firsthand. A 2012 Olympian in diving, she grew up immersed in the sport—coached by her parents, competing at Stanford, and training for years beyond. When she reached her dream of competing at the London Games, she also knew it was time to move on.

In this conversation, Cassidy Krug shares the lessons she learned about navigating major life transitions—from sport to career, and from an “all-in” life to an “à la carte” one. She talks candidly about the identity shifts, the uncertainty of new beginnings, and the importance of reflection, interpretation, and community. Her story offers inspiration and practical wisdom for anyone facing their own turning points, especially those contemplating or entering retirement.

Cassidy Krug joins us from Los Angeles.

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We Discuss

  • The emotional challenges of retiring from something when you still love what you do
  • Why we tend to cling too long to what we do—and what helps us let go
  • The critical role of interpreting your story, not just reacting to change
  • How asking for help (and informational interviews) opened new doors in her career
  • Creating an “à la carte” life after diving, balancing career, creativity, and relationships
  • The value of curiosity and trying new things—even when you’re used to being an expert
  • Why investing in community matters so much after leaving a team or workplace
  • The best advice she received (and what she wishes she had) about embracing change

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Bio 

Cassidy Krug is the author of Resurface: A Guide to Navigating Life’s Biggest Transitions. She is a former Olympic diver, a writer, and a brand and innovation strategist based in Los Angeles. She graduated from Stanford with an English degree and she won two NCAA diving titles there.

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For More on Cassidy Krug

Resurface: A Guide to Navigating Life’s Biggest Transitions

Website

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Podcast Conversations You May Like

The Portfolio Life – Christina Wallace

Strategic Quitting – Julia Keller

Edit Your Life – Elisabeth Sharp McKetta

The Skill Set for Life’s Transitions – Bruce Feiler

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About The Retirement Wisdom Podcast

There are many podcasts on retirement, often hosted by financial advisors with their own financial motives, that cover the money side of the street. This podcast is different. You’ll get smarter about the investment decisions you’ll make about the most important asset you’ll have in retirement: your time.

About Retirement Wisdom

I help people who are retiring, but aren’t quite done yet, discover what’s next and build their custom version of their next life. A meaningful retirement doesn’t just happen by accident.

Schedule a call today to discuss how the Designing Your Life process created by Bill Burnett & Dave Evans can help you make your life in retirement a great one — on your own terms.

About Your Podcast Host

Joe Casey is an executive coach who helps people design their next life after their primary career and create their version of The Multipurpose Retirement.™ He created his own next chapter after a 26-year career at Merrill Lynch, where he was Senior Vice President and Head of HR for Global Markets & Investment Banking.

Joe has earned Master’s degrees from the University of Southern California in Gerontology (at age 60), the University of Pennsylvania, and Middlesex University (UK), a BA in Psychology from the University of Massachusetts at Amherst, and his coaching certification from Columbia University.

In addition to his work with clients, Joe hosts The Retirement Wisdom Podcast, ranked in the top 1% globally in popularity by Listen Notes, with over 1.6 million downloads. Business Insider recognized Joe as one of 23 innovative coaches who are making a difference. He’s the author of Win the Retirement Game: How to Outsmart the 9 Forces Trying to Steal Your Joy.

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Wise Quotes

On Transitions

“Change is something that happens to you. Transition is how you choose to react to that change. But the real work is in interpretation—deciding how you want to remember and carry that story forward.”

On Redefining Success

“First of all, just by asking the question, what does success look like for me? What do I want in my retirement? And it’s not going to be a status quo answer that’s given to you by your career. Maybe for a very long time, you wanted to get the next promotion to get the next pay raise, or to have more responsibility. And all of a sudden, like that ladder is gone and you ask yourself, what does success look like for me now? Maybe success looks like showing up as well as I can and having a positive impact on my family. Maybe success looks like finding people who are still in the workforce and mentoring them and helping them to guide them to make the right decisions. Maybe success looks like making an impact in a totally different sphere, but bringing all the skills that I learned in the workplace to a non-profit or to a different arena. But you really do have to sit and reflect and ask that question of yourself and not expect that the world is necessarily going to tell you anymore what it means to live a successful life.”

On Quitting

“Every time I’ve quit something, it’s directed my life in ways I didn’t see coming—and that I’m immensely grateful for.”

On Moving Forward

“Don’t try to replace what you’re leaving behind. Honor it. Then look for the pieces you loved and carry them into your next chapter.”

On Interpreting Your Story

“And for me, I choose to think back on the Olympic experience as one that I’m really proud of, rather than one that I messed up and I’m regretful for. Absolutely, it takes choice. It takes a lot of reflection. It takes taking the first swell of emotions, whatever that might be, and questioning it, and looking at  from a broader perspective with a longer lens, but I do think that we,  always have a choice in how we interpret our own stories.  And I think it’s so important to get that right according to how we want to feel about ourselves.”

On Trying New Things…and an à la carte life

“..at first it’s scary because when you have an all-in-one life, so many decisions are made for you. So many choices are just obvious because you have only one thing at the middle. And so when you don’t anymore, the balancing of things, the trying to decide what the right path is, you have all those questions more often. But I think answering those kind of questions constantly –  Am I doing what I want to do? Am I being fulfilled? How do I shift maybe some time and energy away from this and into this other thing? That’s been such a fulfilling part of what my life has been since I started living this à la carte life. In general, I don’t love trying new things. I love being good at things. And so it’s always hard to put myself in that situation where I don’t feel the same level of accomplishment as I did when I was the best in the world diver. That said, for me, once I get into them a little bit, so once, you’re in day two, day three, day four, once I started trapeze and started to feel the process of learning and growing and was exploring new sides of myself, then it grew into a passion for me.”

Six Fridays This Fall to Design What You’ll Be Retiring To

Starts on October 3rd

Learn more here – Limited to 10 participants. Take the first step toward shaping your future – register now.

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On this episode of The Retirement Wisdom Podcast, we’re joined by Carl Landau, creator and host of I Used to Be Somebody. Carl brings warmth, humor, and introspection as he explores the twists and turns of retiring after an entrepreneurial journey. He shares why letting go of your work identity, redefining purpose, and discovering a mix of new creative outlets—like podcasting, documentary filmmaking, and pickleball—can light up your retirement.

Carl reminds us that slowing down doesn’t mean stopping, and that reinvention can be both fun and fulfilling.

What You’ll Learn

  • How Retirement is an Evolving Process—finding your way takes some time, especially for high achievers

  • Why Setting Boundaries is Key —how to avoid turning hobbies into a new full-time job… and losing your freedom

  • How Letting Go Frees You—who you were doesn’t define who you’ll be next

  • Why Saying “No” is a Game Changer— create space for what truly matters now to you, not for other people’s agendas

  • How to Build Your New Life  — develop a meaningful life plan, not just a financial one for retirement

Carl Landau joins us from Sacramento, California.

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Bio

Carl Landau is the founder of Pickleball Media. He has been an entrepreneur since the age of 26 and started and sold three successful media companies, published five magazines (software development, winemaking and craft brewing industries). He currently hosts the popular podcast I Used to be Somebody, inspiring 50-plus-year-olds how to build their (un)retirement good life. He’s the co-author of the book, Pickleball for Dummies.

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For More on Carl Landau

I Used to Be Somebody

Pickleball for Dummies

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Podcast Episodes You May Like

Your Identity Beyond Your Job Title – Laverne McKinnon

Lessons Learned in Retirement That Can Help You – Judith Nadratowski

The Art of a Balanced Life in Retirement – Dr. Marybeth Crane

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About The Retirement Wisdom Podcast

There are many podcasts on retirement, often hosted by financial advisors with their own financial motives, that cover the money side of the street. This podcast is different. You’ll get smarter about the investment decisions you’ll make about the most important asset you’ll have in retirement: your time.

About Retirement Wisdom

I help people who are retiring, but aren’t quite done yet, discover what’s next and build their custom version of their next life. A meaningful retirement doesn’t just happen by accident.

Schedule a call today to discuss how the Designing Your Life process created by Bill Burnett & Dave Evans can help you make your life in retirement a great one — on your own terms.

About Your Podcast Host

Joe Casey is an executive coach who helps people design their next life after their primary career and create their version of The Multipurpose Retirement.™ He created his own next chapter after a 26-year career at Merrill Lynch, where he was Senior Vice President and Head of HR for Global Markets & Investment Banking.

Joe has earned Master’s degrees from the University of Southern California in Gerontology (at age 60), the University of Pennsylvania, and Middlesex University (UK), a BA in Psychology from the University of Massachusetts at Amherst, and his coaching certification from Columbia University.

In addition to his work with clients, Joe hosts The Retirement Wisdom Podcast, ranked in the top 1% globally in popularity by Listen Notes, with over 1.6 million downloads. Business Insider recognized Joe as one of 23 innovative coaches who are making a difference. He’s the author of Win the Retirement Game: How to Outsmart the 9 Forces Trying to Steal Your Joy.

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Wise Quotes

On Identity in Retirement

“About three months ago, I was playing [pickelball] with this guy and explaining to him how to play a short game…He’s a big time like doctor, and all I had absolutely no idea. And no one makes a big deal what they did. And no one cares. So I think that’s sort of a surprise too.”

On Mistakes to Avoid

“The other big regret is people don’t think in advance about what they want to do in retirement. In retrospect, they didn’t get give enough thought to it, and  felt like they wasted that first year – and wish that they hadn’t, especially with longevity. If you’re in your 60s, and you’re in pretty good health, there’s a good chance you’re going to  live to 90. It’s a long time. So you want to get the most out of it. We’ve said it a million times: more people think about that two week vacation than they ever think about what to do for the next 25 years. So I think that’s the biggest mistake people make.”

On Stepping Out of Your Comfort Zone

“About four years ago, I saw this ad on Facebook. The local theater in Sacramento, was offering for the first time, a Stand Up Comedy Workshop. And I knew if I thought about it long enough, I would not do it. And this is something that I’ve talked about for a long time. In your family, they’re just rolling their eyes at this point because you’ve said this like a dozen times. So my whole thing is like to do it. So I just paid the 400 bucks to take the workshop. And it was just five classes. And then the final was that we had to do stand up, at least a five minute stand up, for over a hundred people, in a live audience. And mine ended up being 14 minutes. The guy had me close it – and it was incredible. It was one of the scariest things I’ve ever done. But boy, what a high when it’s done. And Joe, the really funny thing is the guy who taught it, who’s a professional comedian, said, Hey, you’re really good. You should do this. You could do this. And I have zero interest in doing it. I just wanted to try it and do it. And that’s all I needed to do. And that was really nice.”